Beliefs and women's signals of interest

This topic contains 20 replies, has 4 voices, and was last updated by  Alexander 1 month ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 21 total)
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  • #22775

    Doug
    Participant

    As a rational person, I cannot deny that women may have made signals to me in the past that I didn’t see, or that I saw them but didn’t recognize them for what they were. I also take Leigh’s point that believing beliefs and living uniquely according to them is limiting. Quite apart from the fact that I can’t honestly see how any woman could be attracted to me (and so give me signals), I have no idea how to ‘recognize’ signals for what they are. If I could ‘see’ them, I’d still need to ‘believe’ – there’s that concept again – that what I’m seeing is what it is, and then act on it. Part of this comes from the reality that in this day and age, as a guy, I don’t wish to invite an accusation against me. In the absence of signals, I keep my feelings of interest to myself.

    #22776

    Jimmy
    Participant

    Why do you need to see them? Is the underlying issue here that you want to escalate but feel uncomfortable/unsure? Is that in the ballpark?

    #22779

    Leigh
    Keymaster

    @jimmy, this is the continuation of a comment thread Doug and I had on one of the articles about rejection. If you want to catch the thread, start here: https://lifeoperatingsystem.com/1-technique-to-guarantee-you-will-never-be-rejected-by-women/#comment-5261

    I can’t honestly see how any woman could be attracted to me

    Doug, this is the part of your comment that I wanted to explore.

    What is it about you and your life that is impossible for a woman to be attracted to? And what would need to change about your life for it to be possible a woman to be attracted to you?

    #22784

    Doug
    Participant

    Throughout my life I’ve seen all sorts of guys getting women’s attention – I have never gotten any at all.  Literally none.  It’s obvious that other guys have something I don’t – namely the ability to attract women.  Since men have to compete for women’s attention, clearly other guys are attractive and I am not, leading me to conclude that I can’t attract women.  I honestly have no idea what would need to change for it to be possible a woman to be attracted to me – or if it is possible at all.  I have talked to woman friends about this – their response has been that I “…just need to show my masculine (sexual) side” when I interact with women I’m attracted to.  I honestly have no idea what they’re talking about and so don’t know where to start.

    #22791

    Doug
    Participant

    Additionally, men are advised that not to act on [extremely subtle] signals from a woman (like moments of eye contact) is a big mistake.  We’re told that the woman already feels like she’s given a green light, and that if  a guy doesn’t do anything, she’ll think it’s because he’s not interested.  In a world where accusers are routinely believed (often but not always justifiably) and accused are deemed guilty by default (pretty much always), I’m not about to approach a woman – no matter how attractive I find her – if I sort of think I see what might be a signal.  I do not want – nor will I allow myself – to be put in a position where I lose friends, credibility – and possibly my job, property and freedom.  I do not see any way to get around this because this is – so we are told – the way it is.  Other guys are able to attract women – somehow – and I am not.

    #22793

    Jimmy
    Participant

    Honestly, I could probably handle this one in person but I think this is beyond me.  Not because you’re difficult or anything but I’ve never done online coaching.  I still don’t see what the issue is and how I can help you.  I think women CAN be attracted to you.  If there’s anything here you walk away with.  You can be attractive.  Why would you not?  Are there some people who are attractive and some people who aren’t?  You are attractive man.  Because the things that a person are (brave, courageous, kind, attractive) are things that you do every day.  It’s what you DO that defines you. And you ARE attractive.  Don’t lose hope.

    #22795

    Leigh
    Keymaster

    I’ve been thinking about this thread for a while now and the one thing I keep coming back to is that it seems like you don’t actually want a solution. You’re not looking for ways to move your life forward and challenge your limitations.

    It seems as though all you want to do is talk about the reasons why you can’t live the life you want.

    Every time we challenge your beliefs and start moving forward, you keep coming back to these same foundations of “No woman could find me attractive and even if she did, I’d be fool to make any kind of move because I’d offend people”, even though you’ve acknowledged that your beliefs are based on faulty logic.

    Until you decided that you’re going to look for a way to live the life you want rather than reasons why you can’t, this conversation is pretty pointless. We’re just going to keep talking about the same things over and over again and wasting our time while not making any progress.

    I’m happy to help you, but it only works if you want to help yourself.

    #22812

    Doug
    Participant

    I get your frustration, Leigh.  As I said a few days ago, “I honestly have no idea what would need to change for it to be possible a woman to be attracted to me.”  I’ve raised this with several woman friends (and/or they’ve raised it with me) – their response has been that I “…just need to show my masculine (sexual) side” when I interact with women I’m attracted to.  I honestly have no idea what they’re talking about and so don’t know where to start.  My women friends say I am attractive but that I can’t see it and so can’t be confident in myself around women I find sexually attractive.  Basically they say I need to ‘feel sexually attractive’ before I can actually be that – but I don’t, and never have.  Does this give us something to work with?

    • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by  Leigh.
    #22813

    Jimmy
    Participant

    Why did you come here?  Honest question.  Why are you on this site?

    #22814

    Doug
    Participant

    Hi Jimmy – thank you for your interest.  I’m here to see if someone can help me find out how – as a guy – to ‘feel sexually attractive’.  As I mentioned in my last response, my women friends have told me time and time again that in order to attract women on a sexual level, I have to be first of all accept myself as attractive that way (i.e., that I have something to offer women and that I can be chosen by women as a mate) – and I just can’t seem to do it.  I’m looking for  guidance on how to do that – I’ve never been able to – and it’s frustrating because I want to meet women and have all sorts of fun, not just the platonic kind I have plenty of now.  My women friends tell me that women need to be ‘lead to the bedroom’ and if I can’t see myself as being worthy of taking a woman there, it won’t happen.  Any thoughts?

    #22816

    Leigh
    Keymaster

    I get your frustration, Leigh. As I said a few days ago, “I honestly have no idea what would need to change for it to be possible a woman to be attracted to me.”

    We’re back at this point again: https://lifeoperatingsystem.com/how-to-attract-women/

    This is what needs to change.

    Last time I linked to this, you said “I read your article (that you quoted a link to twice) and it was of zero help to me. As I said, it’s a great article, but the fact is, no woman could ever be attracted to me no matter what I do.” without even doing anything or trying anything and if you want to us to keep working with you, then you need to start looking at your life and taking responsibility for changing your situation rather than just saying “I won’t work for me…”

    For a more practical place to start your transformation, read this: https://lifeoperatingsystem.com/how-to-be-more-masculine/

    It’s the ‘how’ behind what your female friends have been telling you.

    #22830

    Doug
    Participant

    Thank you for sticking with me, Leigh.  I get the ‘what’ of your message, but am still at a complete loss regarding the ‘how’.  Among the good points you make, you say, “f you can make a woman experience what she wants to experience, then she will be attracted to you. If you can’t, then she won’t.” I have many female friends – a few of whom are among my closest friends in fact, but it’s all platonic.  I have no problem ‘attracting women as [very good] friends, but don’t know how to move to a sexual relationship.  As I said in a response to Jimmy, in order to attract a woman sexually, I need to be able to accept that I am / can be sexually attractive.  I just can’t seem to do that.  I’m certainly not saying the things you’ve said here / in your articles don’t apply to me – but that I don’t know how to apply them.  My women friends say I need to ‘act sexual’ – but I don’t know how – because I don’t know how to make myself see myself as a sexual person.  

    #22831

    Jimmy
    Participant

    Also, you said you want to FEEL sexually attractive.  You want to FEEL masculine.  It’s important to note that FEELING “sexually attractive” and people being attracted to you are two different things.  So is it that you want people to be attracted to you or you want to feel sexually attractive/masculine/confident/manly.  Or perhaps are you trying to feel wanted and are looking at women to fulfill that need in you.  There are layers here.  And the first step to discovering those layers is figure out what you want out of this venture.

    I would suggest reading the article for now.  Maybe we’ll find out something new.  Best of luck.

    #22833

    Doug
    Participant

    Hi Jimmy – If I can make a woman feel sexually attracted to me, then she will be.  To do that – as I understand – I first need to accept myself as a sexual person that is able to attract women in the first place.  This is what I take from Leigh’s articles and other sources, and this is where my block is – it doesn’t have anything to do with anyone but me.  I’d like to feel wanted by a woman, yes – but I totally get that for that to happen, I need to sense that I can be someone who someone else could want in that way.  I take your point that feeling sexually attractive and being attractive to others are two separate things, but the second can’t happen without the first, right?  Correct me if I’m wrong.

    #22834

    Jimmy
    Participant

    It can, it’s just probably not as likely.  You can attract a woman and not feel attractive.  You can feel attractive and not attract a woman.  I’m not giving you steps.  I’m trying to clarify exactly what you want.  Out of all the things you’ve listed, which is the most important one? Feeling masculine? Attracting women?  Feeling wanted?  What is the core reason why you are here?  What do you want more than anything in the world? Maybe you could describe it as a specific experience.  Type to us what your perfect night would look like.  Down to what you’re wearing, are you with friends, what do you guys do, what does she look like, what does she say, what do you feel.  And so on and so forth.  This will give us an idea of what’s really going on.

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